Comments on: Imperial scales may give short measure – says metric group http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2008/01/18/imperial-scales-giving-short-measure/ Commentary on the measurement muddle in the UK Tue, 06 Jan 2009 13:12:10 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.0.5 by: EuroMillions Lotto http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2008/01/18/imperial-scales-giving-short-measure/#comment-12414 Sat, 26 Apr 2008 12:41:23 +0000 http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2008/01/18/imperial-scales-giving-short-measure/#comment-12414 They will continue using the wrong units, as long as they can profit from giving smaller measures than they should. They will continue using the wrong units, as long as they can profit from giving smaller measures than they should.

]]> by: Phil Hall http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2008/01/18/imperial-scales-giving-short-measure/#comment-8880 Fri, 18 Jan 2008 21:57:36 +0000 http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2008/01/18/imperial-scales-giving-short-measure/#comment-8880 The so called "metric martyrs" have been playing a cunning game with the media and the public. They mix up so many different issues. They conspicuously fail to make it clear that legal enforcement of units for trade, with criminal penalties for non-compliance, has been an established practice for more than a century, just as much in Britain as elsewhere. To hear them talk you'd think it was invented by the EU. They may not say as much outright but that is what they want us to think. It wouldn't be so bad if they were to encourage sensible debate. If they believe that criminalising traders for not using units selected for that purpose is wrong in principle then fine, but leave Brussels out of it, it didn't start there, it's endemic in our own legal system. If they don't necessarily quarrel with that but want to debate what the actual choice should be then OK, but don't pretend that we can have it both ways with metric and imperial having equal status, disregarding the issue of the two systems muddle. Whilst it may be true that for some time both metric and imperial were legal in the UK, prescribed quantities for packaged goods discriminated against metric so it didn't catch on. The Years 1995 (for packaged goods) and 2000 (for loose goods) heralded the final push to get the trade sector to where it was supposed to be at least 20 years before at a time when people would have had a better understanding of the real purpose behind it. As it is we have seen a prolonged negligence on the part of successive governments and a growing Euro-sceptic lobby hijack it for their own ends. Irrespective of what anyone may think about the European question I would appeal to people to try and separate that out from metrication and consider it on its own merits. Would the arguments in favour of complete metrication be any different if we were to withdraw from the EU tomorrow? We'd still have to trade with the rest of the world which is predominantly metric. All the consumer issues and the main arguments in favour of a single system would still be just as valid. Anyone who opposes British membership of the EU does not have to oppose metrication. So think about it! The so called “metric martyrs” have been playing a cunning game with the media and the public. They mix up so many different issues. They conspicuously fail to make it clear that legal enforcement of units for trade, with criminal penalties for non-compliance, has been an established practice for more than a century, just as much in Britain as elsewhere. To hear them talk you’d think it was invented by the EU. They may not say as much outright but that is what they want us to think.
It wouldn’t be so bad if they were to encourage sensible debate. If they believe that criminalising traders for not using units selected for that purpose is wrong in principle then fine, but leave Brussels out of it, it didn’t start there, it’s endemic in our own legal system.
If they don’t necessarily quarrel with that but want to debate what the actual choice should be then OK, but don’t pretend that we can have it both ways with metric and imperial having equal status, disregarding the issue of the two systems muddle.
Whilst it may be true that for some time both metric and imperial were legal in the UK, prescribed quantities for packaged goods discriminated against metric so it didn’t catch on.
The Years 1995 (for packaged goods) and 2000 (for loose goods) heralded the final push to get the trade sector to where it was supposed to be at least 20 years before at a time when people would have had a better understanding of the real purpose behind it. As it is we have seen a prolonged negligence on the part of successive governments and a growing Euro-sceptic lobby hijack it for their own ends.
Irrespective of what anyone may think about the European question I would appeal to people to try and separate that out from metrication and consider it on its own merits. Would the arguments in favour of complete metrication be any different if we were to withdraw from the EU tomorrow? We’d still have to trade with the rest of the world which is predominantly metric. All the consumer issues and the main arguments in favour of a single system would still be just as valid.
Anyone who opposes British membership of the EU does not have to oppose metrication. So think about it!

]]> by: Ezra Steinberg http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2008/01/18/imperial-scales-giving-short-measure/#comment-8876 Fri, 18 Jan 2008 19:18:18 +0000 http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2008/01/18/imperial-scales-giving-short-measure/#comment-8876 An additional issue is that the vast majority of shopkeepers who have complied with the law spent money to purchase compliant scales. It is unfair to those shopkeepers that there are a few others who have avoided spending their money to invest in legal weighing equipment. An additional issue is that the vast majority of shopkeepers who have complied with the law spent money to purchase compliant scales. It is unfair to those shopkeepers that there are a few others who have avoided spending their money to invest in legal weighing equipment.

]]> by: Martin Vlietstra http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2008/01/18/imperial-scales-giving-short-measure/#comment-8874 Fri, 18 Jan 2008 14:01:15 +0000 http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2008/01/18/imperial-scales-giving-short-measure/#comment-8874 In French and Spanish markets stall holders position their scales so that shoppers can clearly see not only their “certificates of authorisation” (in the form of on officially-issued sticker), but also the unit price of the product, the weight of the product and total amount due. In contrast in UK markets, traders do not have to display any certificates of authorisation regarding their weighting equipment and the scales’ displays are often hidden by displays of goods or the scales are almost out of sight of the customer. This amounts to a licence for Del Boy to print money. Is it not time that UK traders also be required to display at least a “certificate of authenticity” that their scales have been serviced? This would be akin to the legislation that requires all motor cars that are over three years old to have an MoT examination, necessary before a tax disc can be obtained. In French and Spanish markets stall holders position their scales so that shoppers can clearly see not only their “certificates of authorisation” (in the form of on officially-issued sticker), but also the unit price of the product, the weight of the product and total amount due. In contrast in UK markets, traders do not have to display any certificates of authorisation regarding their weighting equipment and the scales’ displays are often hidden by displays of goods or the scales are almost out of sight of the customer. This amounts to a licence for Del Boy to print money.

Is it not time that UK traders also be required to display at least a “certificate of authenticity” that their scales have been serviced? This would be akin to the legislation that requires all motor cars that are over three years old to have an MoT examination, necessary before a tax disc can be obtained.

]]> by: David K http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2008/01/18/imperial-scales-giving-short-measure/#comment-8871 Fri, 18 Jan 2008 12:44:15 +0000 http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2008/01/18/imperial-scales-giving-short-measure/#comment-8871 Why do these people call themselves "metric martyrs"? The term suggests that they were killed for their beliefs, and using the term metric suggests it was because they were great believers in metric. A christian martyr was someone who was killed for being a christian. These people using imperial illegally are really just total fakes and phonies. I think you are right in that it is a political game, with one group of activists wanting to use situations like this for their own political cause. The real solution is for the government to provide proper education for all consumers in metric and promote the use of metric through advertising, etc., so that consumers will want to ask for loose goods in metric. Then these greedy stallholders who overcharge and deceive through the use of dodgy scales will find they have no custom when they insist on continuing to defraud their customers. Why do these people call themselves “metric martyrs”? The term suggests that they were killed for their beliefs, and using the term metric suggests it was because they were great believers in metric. A christian martyr was someone who was killed for being a christian. These people using imperial illegally are really just total fakes and phonies. I think you are right in that it is a political game, with one group of activists wanting to use situations like this for their own political cause.
The real solution is for the government to provide proper education for all consumers in metric and promote the use of metric through advertising, etc., so that consumers will want to ask for loose goods in metric. Then these greedy stallholders who overcharge and deceive through the use of dodgy scales will find they have no custom when they insist on continuing to defraud their customers.

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